looks like the festival bubble is bursting.

''What I thought was a great industry and one that I always wanted to get involved in just turned out to be nothing like what I had expected. There are a lot of people out there who've taken advantage of us: a couple of young blokes new to this.”

So was Azza lying when he stated in the original thread that they'd had experience putting on events before?

Two words. Clown Shoes.

Azza was lying from that first post:

Azza said about 9 months ago or at 9:22PM on Monday, January 12 2009. Hey Guys,

I just got told about a new 3 day music festival in Melb in September!! One of my mates bands just got booked it sounds cool as. He says they aren't taking bands that do every aussie music festival ( Cut Copy,living end, The presets ). He wouldn't tell me what bands are booked but he says tickets are like $120 and the guys running it are just a group of young guys who love music and don't care about the money.
Anyone know anything more

They have had 'experience' in running school projects at William Angliss and a loose association with Live aid (ie - probably a volunteer)

Maybe their dad is John Denison.

Who had that fake John Denison log-in? Might be time it resurfaced for expert commentary.

Sad.

hold on, its not like people haven't done this before and people who are much much more experienced in this type of thing

summersault anyone?

Exactly, burden, but these dudes clearly failed to learn from other's mistakes despite all their ''two year's of planning'' and advice from folks here who've seen this before.

timewaster said about 9 months ago:

Attention: Azza.

Are you joking? Your festival is a recipe for disaster.

Unless you want to lose a lot of money, you must follow the golden rule of band booking. It's ALL ABOUT THE HEADLINER!

If you're charging over $120 a ticket, there is NO WAY that you will even cover costs unless you've got some bloody popular headliners. The festival market is very competitive. Very few people will be dumb enough to spend $140 to see some bands they can watch at the Tote for ten bucks.

And don't expect the daft Aussie parochialism to sell many tickets. Audiences go for the music, not a vile flag-waving exercise. Homebake sells out because IMC book a lot of big, popular Australian acts from a variety of styles. They always have a huge headliner like Crowded House or Nick Cave. And you want to charge MORE for a ticket than Homebake! Your line-up better be huge!

Expecially if you're expecting people to drive all the way to the bush!!!

You need a headliner as big as Nick Cave (for the 'good music' crowd), or Powderfinger (for the mainstream bogan crowd).

People will only pay $140 for a big line-up of Australian music.

Azza, do some research. Look at Global Gathering, The Hot Barbeque, the Climate Change festival. These events all recently stiffed and they were IN THE CITY!

And your festival is in the bloody bush!

Good luck. I hope you're not gonna be owing $300 000 to the bank.

Looks like Timewaster was on the money

Anyone have a linkety link to the Age article? I can't find it...

he was $200,000 off!

Anyone have a linkety link to the Age article? I can't find it...

it's in the article in blue.

''What about the two years of planning and effort that we put into this, which Aaron and I got paid nothing for?'', he said. ''All these people complaining that they're out of pocket for three days work.''

My favorite quote from the Hun

can't believe they can pull 4000 people there.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/an-unintended-blueprint-for-a-festival-fiasco-20091014-gxj1.html

Looks like Timewaster was on the money

Except for the fact that ticket sales don't seem to have been the problem.
Ticket prices, maybe.

thanks, jose.

Except for the fact that ticket sales don't seem to have been the problem. Ticket prices, maybe.

$500,000 loss = $125 per person loss who supposedly went. That would have meant $250 tickets.

Personally I don't believe 4000 went, which would mean a loss of even more per person.

The gate is only part of what they would take, though. Article seems to indicate they were banking on food and alcohol sales, too.

Yeah, Eastside is right.

As a live venue, it must be hard for the Tote. It's too small and dingy for most overseas bands, who play at the Corner or the Prince. And when Tote bands get more popular (ie. Eddy Current Suppression Ring, The Drones), they stop playing the Tote and do bigger venues.

So the Tote has to book developing local acts, which is great for the music scene but difficult financially (since new young bands usually bring about 20 friends to a gig).

As someone who did the door on a weekly basis at the Tote, I can tell you that it's not just overseas bands who bring the crowds. See the Rat vs Possum Wednesday night residency some months back - three out of four Wednesday nights at 200+ people. No-one saw that coming.

I can also tell you that, prior to the whole closing news, I've worked a gig almost every week that pulls more punters than many international acts at any other small to mid size venue in town. You can't simply pick 'big name' sellers over nurturing local acts because the business model makes sense on paper. That's not the point of the Tote. I'm sure it's not the point of the Old Bar or the Birmi etc either.

You're right kuro, it's great when a venue gets in a new act and it works well for all parties so you book them again and again and then there becomes this association between the band and venue, like a spiritual bond (gay). But I've seen it hapen and it's a wonderful thing.

I can tell you that it's not just overseas bands who bring the crowds.

I'm thinking of the Stabs LP launch, the Spooky Records night, the Deaf Wish LP launch and New Years Eve recovery session. All had very healthy crowds, if not sell-out crowds.

Would it be fair to say then that the Tote was a profitable and sustainable business before the whole licensing/Azza issues?

liamsnice said 15 seconds ago:
You're right kuro, it's great when a venue gets in a new act and it works well for all parties so you book them again and again and then there becomes this association between the band and venue, like a spiritual bond (gay). But I've seen it hapen and it's a wonderful thing.

It is wonderful indeed. #7(gay is not an insult, dude. And I doubt that you were using it as something positive. Sorry for being the PC police. kthxbye )

Would it be fair to say then that the Tote was a profitable and sustainable business before the whole licensing/Azza issues?

The big question, really.

As much as everyone would like to pin the blame for the Tote's closure solely on LLV it was only the straw that broke the camel's back - which means the camel must have already had a bit of a load on it already, right?

Wouldn't it be as much the fault of whoever gave them the booze 'on tick' as the brothers themselves?

And they got into trouble for it

I thought ''sale or return'' would be a pretty common business arrangement for big events?

very funny, modi. it's a bit difficult to ''return'' beer that has been stolen from a paddock or sold off cheaply to local Ararat pubs

50 cases of beer got stolen, supposedly. That's not 75K worth.

I'm just saying, letting someone take stock without paying for it immediately is not uncommon, if not normal. You just have to know that the people you're dealing with can be trusted to pay up.

Returning all the unsold beer to the supplier instead of effectively stealing it themselves would have been the right thing to do. Obviously

You just have to know that the people you're dealing with can be trusted to pay up.

Herein lies the problem.

50 got stolen, but how much got sold or flogged off by the organisers afterwards?

Yeah, I get that. I'm just saying that whoever ''gave it to them on tick'' is not equally to blame for them being sneaky fuckers.

What?!>??!?!?!

whatever became of these chumps?

soundwave revolution promoters?

Any more ever come out of all this? Did the boys go back to their lives?