On TV this weekend I understand.

This is only really relevant if you have money.

what makes you say that?

I'm not sure he understood the question, KB.

I think my mum does this on her little patch of land (f'nar). That's all I have to offer on the subject.

Kabuki- To do anything decent with permaculture you need a decent plot of land, and the money to make the house eco faced. Heck, I knew about permaculture waaaayyyy before it was cool. Bunch of hippies in the blue mountains thinking that it's going to save them when society collapses.

I pointed out there was a bikie headquarters kind of deal down the road, and they'd better have some guns to keep it. They didn't get it.

Idiots.

No, the point is no matter where you live you can apply it. I don't think you understood it at all.

I'm sure Bill Mollison would love to meet you.

What, you think I haven't met him already?

Sure modi. You can have your little tomato plot out the back. But the full intergrated permaculture setup DOES require more dirt than most people have.

Try and realise that I may know a lot more about this subject than you're aware of, and consider that what I say actually has a solid basis to it.

In answer to your question, kabuki, yes, everywhere I've ever lived I have applied permaculture principles, and grown at least some of my food, whether it was in a concrete gardened inner city cottage or out in the burbs where we had ducks and a big polygreenhouse. I've never paid for anything but seeds, pretty much, but that was a bit of a fetish, one year I spent $300 on mail order seeds. Still have most of those varieties. But since I was made a lifetime member of seedsavers I don't need to buy them anymore.

Everywhere I've ever lived has also got food plants still growing there, too, as far as I know, because I always plant weedy ones, like Jerusalem artichokes, that look after themselves.

I just saw the other day portable rain water storage tanks, as in collapsible ones, so when I move again, that will definitely be an option. Basically it's about designing your living space to be as efficient as possible and supply as much of your requirements as possible.

Okay, I'll try and realise that, while you continue to talk out your arse.

One of the main things you haven't taken from the philosophy is knowledge sharing, so unless you're going to crack open that knobbly cranium and spill out the facts, how about you fuck off to another thread and talk about chicks or something else you don't get.

One of the main things you've never understood in your life is not casting pearls before swine.

You think this is how it works ''Hey BADALEX! I'm modi! I'm going to be a complete fucking idiot, prove over and over again just how sloppy my thinking is, and to top it off, I'm going to be a cunt to you! Now, would you mind sharing your knowledge with me that took you many years of extremely diligent effort? Because that makes sense in my mind!''

I don't happen to feel that's how it works.

This thread is about permaculture, not about you.

Permaculture is a way of designing human settlements sustainably so they require little input from outside, beyond sunlight and rainfall, and produce as little waste as possible. It's a combination of the words ''permanent'' and ''agriculture'' though in recent years the ''agri'' is not the main focus.

It does not mean self sufficiency for individuals, but sustainability for human populations. So you need no more money to begin to implement it than you would to go about normal household maintenance tasks, except there are smart ways to arrange gardens, buildings, fences, etc in order to maximise their productivity.

One of the things I've learned in my life is that pearls are like a kind of oyster cancer that can break your teeth. And swine are very good to allow into the orchard, fattening themselves on the fallen fruit and preventing codling moth and fruit fly from completing their lifecycle. They also do well in mixed forests of chestnut and oak, where they become nicely flavoured by the woody flavour of the falling nuts, so when winter comes, they are ready for the spit.

And kabuki, the whole lazy thing is exactly why the guy started it in the first place. He figured, why not have food just falling off trees in every yard and on every street, so if you were hungry, you could go for a walk and eat lunch on your way.

One of the most important things about permaculture, is that you can't be an expert, because every location is different, and requires different solutions. There are a number of approaches that work well in one location, but not in others, and anyone claiming to be a permaculture guru is probably talking crap, even if they have successfully implemented a completely sustainable habitat in one locality. And definitely talking crap if they have done nothing.

It's something you have to learn by doing, not by reading.

Oh, and here's a link if you're interested

It's something you have to learn by doing, not by reading.

++++++++++++++++

that's where my laziness kicks in...

thanks for your input modi - i'd been to the site already and had a look around. i also think my laziness is related to the fact i don't feel particularly attached to where i live (renting) and knowing i'll have to move again sometime etc...

Modi, i've seen the disastrous consequences of putting swine in an orchid- de-barked dead trees.

i reckon you'd be better of with chickens to eat the fallen fruit and quails to eat any vermin. Pigs are too unpredictable and hungry.

Apart from that, all good.

Aquaponics is awesome as well kb.

It's a closed system as well, but you could do it in a garage and it produces fish and vegetables . Like a cross between a recirculating aquaculture and hydroponics- future shit baby, everyones got enough space to do it, you don't need dirt and you can stack the system vertically as well,

I have wondered about the pigs in the orchard thing, actually. Chooks would probably be a better idea. I haven't had chooks for ages, last animals I had were ducks, which are great, but fucking messy, and you need heaps of space.

I always worried quail might get eaten by cats or dogs, because they're so little.

Ive attained recently a bit of land to start some gardening, looking into permaculture currently, sounds interesting, tell me more modi

Is CERES a good place to get some seeds?

I would love to stay in the same place long enough to get a really good permaculture garden going. I seem to just rip up the concrete somewhere, and get good compost going in time to move on.

anyway, tvforcats, best of luck, its awesome to get to eat your own veggies!

Every post makes myself a living archetype but uggh just go to the supermarket.

its awesome to get to eat your own veggies!

lol

Supermarkets are killing the planet.

tvforcats, most libraries have a copy of Introduction to permaculture, and heaps of them have the designer's manual, if they don't, request they buy both books.

But have a read through the first one, it will give you heaps of ideas which you may not copy exactly, but it outlines the basic design principles of

1. Every important need is covered by multiple elements
2. Every element has multiple functions